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View Poll Results: How do you feel about BMW anti-tuning measures?

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  • They have to protect themselves (and their profits).

    8 19.51%
  • They should give their most loyal customers the option of unlocked ECU's with warranty restrictions.

    14 34.15%
  • My next car will NOT be a BMW if they keep this up.

    19 46.34%
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  1. #26
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by greatest335i Click here to enlarge
    maybe it will stop if they only lease the 328 and 128 out so they cant be abused cuz they are too slow lol
    Heh, well that is not an option.

    Why can't they simply specify between leases and purchases? You aren't even supposed to a mod a lease, give those people the encrypted ECU's. You do this and it will increase sales anyway.

    I wonder if I can bring this up to whomever is in charge at BMWNA somehow?
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  2. #27
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
    Heh, well that is not an option.

    Why can't they simply specify between leases and purchases? You aren't even supposed to a mod a lease, give those people the encrypted ECU's. You do this and it will increase sales anyway.

    I wonder if I can bring this up to whomever is in charge at BMWNA somehow?
    bc they are lazy !
    Click here to enlarge

  3. #28
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by greatest335i Click here to enlarge
    bc they are lazy !
    I don't think that is it, I think they just are all about the bottom line now. It certainly takes more money and effort to devise all this anti-tuning bull$#@!.
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  4. #29
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    booooo BMw you should change website ! JDMBOOST !
    Click here to enlarge

  5. #30
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by greatest335i Click here to enlarge
    booooo BMw you should change website ! JDMBOOST !
    I have faith in our tuners to get around BMW's nonsense. If BMW is going to pull this crap, then we have to fight back as best as we can. I'm not going to cry for them losing money in warranty claims, screw them if they want to screw us.
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  6. #31
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    lol how you going to fight back?
    just dont mod your car ;p

  7. #32
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by greatest335i Click here to enlarge
    lol how you going to fight back?
    just dont mod your car ;p
    We fight back by doing it anyway and showing them they can't stop us.
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  8. #33
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    isnt that wat we been doing for YEARS LOL !

    come up with some thing NEWS like.... get all the mods car...... and drive around your local dealership lol

  9. #34
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by greatest335i Click here to enlarge
    isnt that wat we been doing for YEARS LOL !
    Yes but they are trying to eliminate it. They are going to slow the process down more, and more, until it just makes more sense to buy American to tune and have fun.
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  10. #35
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    I reckon its a whole big smoke screen. At this stage there has never been a ECU that hasn't been cracked. The BMW anti tune came out and it was a matter of weeks before it was figured out. The Audi S4 was considered impossible and now its being done very succesfully. The only thing that will change is that the cost of tuning is going to go up because each change the ECU manufacturers make requires new tools to flash them. Tuners will then have to keep up to date with these tools and the expense of this gets passed on to the consumer.

  11. #36
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    1 out of 1 members liked this post. Reputation: Yes | No
    I think LostMarine hit the nail on the head.
    Every time someone beats the snot out of their car and then expects BMW to fix it, it motivates the manufacturer to find ways to avoid that unpleasant experience.
    If the BMW response is to blame even the stuff they SHOULD take responsiblity for on the tune, well, I guess that's just human nature. IMO that behaviour makes them no better than the guy in the first scenario.
    Bottom line - You need to pay to play. BMW can lock things up as tight as they want as far as I'm concerned providing they give me a key to unlock everything. If/when I choose to use the key and tune I will not expect warranty for anything. (Saves a lot of bickering about who's fault it is that ____ broke.) If you don't want to risk paying for a new HPFP (for example) then you'd have two choices. Don't tune or buy something else.
    Dan

  12. #37
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by GTR-Dad Click here to enlarge
    BMW can lock things up as tight as they want as far as I'm concerned providing they give me a key to unlock everything. If/when I choose to use the key and tune I will not expect warranty for anything.
    This is exactly correct, seems we all have a clear understanding. The question is, why doesn't BMW?
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  13. #38
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    Not cool but tuners always find a way. Wasnt it said that the N54 would be untunable? I think the same was said about the n55. So why worry? Its only a matter of time before some one finds a way around anti-tuning.
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    Who said Panamera isnt tuneable? Switzer is performing upgrades on the car. Big power upgrades.

    BMW is doing what everyone is doing. Nothing wrong in that.

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    2010 S4s are being tuned as we speak....and to great success, i might add. I'm not really buying the longevity of this "Untunable ECU" argument....sorry.

  16. #41
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    Oh....and Sportec has already been tuning the Panamera Turbo as well...and they aren't the only ones. ;-)

  17. #42
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by BASELINE Click here to enlarge
    Oh....and Sportec has already been tuning the Panamera Turbo as well...and they aren't the only ones. ;-)
    Yes, but I think he was referring to the newer models that have a different ecu. Have they been tuned yet?
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  18. #43
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    I agree with alot that has been said, especially that if we tune, we lose the warranty. BUT!! It seems to me that alot of people who lose warranty for their engines also lose it for the rest of the car... is this true? I mean a tune doesnt affect your interior, your suspention etc, but it affects the engine. So, if bmw told me that if anything happens to the engine, I have to pay for it, then so be it. I am willing to take on that risk, provided they still perform the same warranty and maintenance procedures minus the engine's. (God, I wish that was the case)

    But BMW know that they have hordcore customers and enthusiasts who dont like to change one minute detail of their cars, and keep them in their original forms for years and years. I guess BMW has them covered; they provide them with leather cleaning supplies.

    And, I am sure BMW is not oblivious to those who like to increase performance, but the way they see it, they want as many people to lease their cars as possible. That way, they get to charge a percentage that they otherwise couldn't and that seems to be the best deal for them. I dont think that BMW will get the message if we keep buying their cars, because honestly, our options just expanded. The american car industry is putting on a hell of a fight and believe me, everyone is taking notice.

    I just wish that after the warranty is over, bmw provide their customers with a way to read the car, diagnose it and care for it without needing to go to the dealership... that or get dealers to start giving a $#@! about their customers and not about squeezing every last penny out of us. Maybe it comes down to the face-to-face relationship we have with BMW...
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  19. #44
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by alq80 Click here to enlarge
    I agree with alot that has been said, especially that if we tune, we lose the warranty. BUT!! It seems to me that alot of people who lose warranty for their engines also lose it for the rest of the car... is this true? I mean a tune doesnt affect your interior, your suspention etc, but it affects the engine. So, if bmw told me that if anything happens to the engine, I have to pay for it, then so be it. I am willing to take on that risk, provided they still perform the same warranty and maintenance procedures minus the engine's. (God, I wish that was the case)
    The Magnusson-Moss act was created for exactly this reason. The burden of proof is on the dealer to show that something you did affected the brakes, or coolant lines, or power window mechanisms. They can't simply void your entire warranty for a tune, it is illegal.
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  20. #45
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
    The Magnusson-Moss act was created for exactly this reason. The burden of proof is on the dealer to show that something you did affected the brakes, or coolant lines, or power window mechanisms. They can't simply void your entire warranty for a tune, it is illegal.
    I know this but (I may have just missed this) I don't recall hearing of people with voided warranties going in for anythin basic. The argument being, the dealer won't touch the car with mods even when warranty is voided.
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  21. #46
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by MHP LLC Click here to enlarge
    Out for over 1.5 years and to date no one has cracked or has even come close to the Siemens RSA 104 byte encrypted controllers with CPU lockout. See 2010 Audi S4 and 2010 Panamera Turbo for evidence. The best and brightest have been working on cracking these since day 1 and have gotten nowhere, and this is just the first gen of super encrypted processors.
    Enjoy it while you can gents, there is pressure from so many sides on this is issue it's not a question of if but when.
    Maybe this will give us reason to buy American again?

    here you go audi b8 s4 been cracked and tuned.

    http://sportec.ch/page7496.html

    worlds first, http://achtuning.com/videos/another-teaser-from-apr-b8-s4-chip-content/

    that just shows that it is possible. you gotta remember, the same ppl that made the ecu "impossible to crack" will be the same ppl to make it possible Click here to enlarge

  22. #47
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by alq80 Click here to enlarge
    I know this but (I may have just missed this) I don't recall hearing of people with voided warranties going in for anythin basic. The argument being, the dealer won't touch the car with mods even when warranty is voided.
    They will touch the car if the warranty is voided, they just will charge you insane money.
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  23. #48
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by fastgti69 Click here to enlarge
    that just shows that it is possible. you gotta remember, the same ppl that made the ecu "impossible to crack" will be the same ppl to make it possible
    I think he is referring to a specific model year of the ECU, not the first S4's but the most recent ones.
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  24. #49
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    Thought this was interesting:

    With this in mind, SEMA (the Specialty Equipment Market Association), through the SEMA Action Network (SAN), gave us an idea of what the current rules are and what they might become in the future.

    You thought SEMA was the organization that produced the parts-and-accessories trade show in Vegas every year, right? So did we... But it turns out SEMA also has an active lobbying presence in Washington DC, working with federal and state regulators to keep the business and pleasure of modifying cars working on both levels.
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    I have no issue with BMW taking this route - other posts point out the reasons in this thread. Also, tuners will always find a way to get around this policy, as mentioned. The problem comes with the N54's fuel system IMHO. It fails regardless of what is or isn't done. We all know BMW doesn't want to help out tuned vehicles. The big hurt is that they usually decide to give "Joe No Tune" a hard time and make him jump through hoops to get anything done under warranty.

    This is a business decision that shows that they don't really care about anyone's satisfaction after that person buys this system - it seems that they figure that having this stance will allow the finances to come out in their favor. Other manufacturers can really clean house with sales if they can bring their product up to a certain level and become more tuner and warranty friendly as well. ( BMW's chief argument on the radio to buy their car is the savings that you can find with their extended service / warranty). Yeah, if you are tuned, this is out, but, even if you aren't tuned, you will most likely not have this advertised experience towards your warranty.

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