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  1. #1
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    ***VIDEO*** BMW E92 M3 (ESS VT-625) vs All-Motor Camaro SS (Mr. TORQ) [HD]

    Info about both of the cars are on the video. I was completely suprised about the results. Both cars had a 1 driver+1 passenger. More vids are on the way...

    Enjoy


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    Wow, pretty impressive for an all motor car doing that against a boosted one. Props!

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    horsepower sells cars, torque wins races
    "We need to upgrade your skill before we upgrade your horsepower"

    -Tommy to Josh

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    where is this located? not many matte bvlue dct cars out there with a 625 kit

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by LostMarine Click here to enlarge
    where is this located? not many matte bvlue dct cars out there with a 625 kit
    Road looks like DNT. Might be the pulley, wrong size injectors, cooling or tune.

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Titan9 Click here to enlarge
    Road looks like DNT. Might be the pulley, wrong size injectors, cooling or tune.
    dnt?

    oh, so, what your implying, is that because ESS lost, there MUST be something wrong with the car? and not that the car is not as fast as the camaro, is that how you take it?

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by LostMarine Click here to enlarge
    dnt?

    oh, so, what your implying, is that because ESS lost, there MUST be something wrong with the car? and not that the car is not as fast as the camaro, is that how you take it?
    you asked were this took place. i answered you - DNT = Dallas North Tollway.

    As for why the M lost, it could me a number things. On paper it appears the M>camaro. in the video the camaro clearly wins the match. Why did it not perform to the ESS spec? it could be a number of things is all i am saying. Tune, bad injectors, pulley, cooling - possible heat soak, etc. Maybe he needs to swap the gears out. AS for the Camaro, it clearly did what it was set up to do. Flat out straight line speed. would love to see how it performs on a track.

    As for my take. i really don't care.

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by ultimateendz Click here to enlarge
    horsepower sells cars, torque wins races
    May God rest Carrol Shelby's soul in peace, but his famous statement was
    nonsense. Torque means nothing, it's the area under the power curve that matters.

    What torque is good for? If we have two identical engines, the one that makes more torque in a certain rpm band, makes more power too in that power band as power and torque are somewhat related, and that's why the motor with more torque wins against the other one.

    real world experience, we have a trucking company. We have a Volvo FH-16 here that has far better torque/weight ratio than M3 but in lower speeds that aerodynamic has very low effect on the brick-shaped truck, it can barely keep up with a 2 cylinder Fiat 500.

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sorena Click here to enlarge
    May God rest Carrol Shelby's soul in peace, but his famous statement was
    nonsense. Torque means nothing, it's the area under the power curve that matters.

    What torque is good for? If we have two identical engines, the one that makes more torque in a certain rpm band, makes more power too in that power band as power and torque are somewhat related, and that's why the motor with more torque wins against the other one.

    real world experience, we have a trucking company. We have a Volvo FH-16 here that has far better torque/weight ratio than M3 but in lower speeds that aerodynamic has very low effect on the brick-shaped truck, it can barely keep up with a 2 cylinder Fiat 500.
    Exactly. Torque without an engine speed means nothing. Torque with engine speed, however is what horsepower is equal to. So, yes - torque wins races if you can spin an engine to a decent speed.

    Another good example is trying to remove a bolt with a 2 foot wrench. The bolt is stuck - however, you are standing on the end of the 2 foot wrench and weigh in at 250 lbs. You are now making 500 ft-lbs of torque. However, since you aren't moving the bolt - no work is getting done, and nothing is happening. Once the bolt moves, you have horsepower. The faster you can turn that wrench with 250 pounds of force, the more you make. Torque is "dimensionless" (this is not an accurate word here - but is good for explanation) - you can have tons of torque at any speed including 0. It means nothing. A great read on this is here (it's long, but extremely good for a full understanding of gearing, high revving engines, torque, etc.) --> http://www.bimmerboost.com/showthrea...819#post347819

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by ultimateendz Click here to enlarge
    horsepower sells cars, torque wins races
    Uh, no, horsepower wins races.

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by ultimateendz Click here to enlarge
    horsepower sells cars, torque wins races
    Dumbest thing I've read all day, thanks Click here to enlarge

    I hope you get a physics lesson for xmas Click here to enlarge

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    So you are telling me that heavy ass camaro with 520whp vs the lighter M3 with DCT and 570whp is faster than the ///M? Wtf?
    John 3:16


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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by leo985i Click here to enlarge
    So you are telling me that heavy ass camaro with 520whp vs the lighter M3 with DCT and 570whp is faster than the ///M? Wtf?
    My thoughts exactly. At least the ///M is better looking Click here to enlarge

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by leo985i Click here to enlarge
    So you are telling me that heavy ass camaro with 520whp vs the lighter M3 with DCT and 570whp is faster than the ///M? Wtf?
    Torque... That LS has boat loads of it from most every rpm especially down low. The M3 while efficient does not have the Tq to move it down low. DCT helps it not get destroyed and you can clearly see the nose lift on each run on the M3 he is WOT even jumps a slight bit. But tq moves you and that's a great display in what tq does for a car. HP is nice for damn sure but Tq down low and in the mid range is hard to beat. Great run and the M looks the business. Feels local for some reason.
    We stay swingin...
    Click here to enlarge

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by RnmEvo9 Click here to enlarge
    Wow, pretty impressive for an all motor car doing that against a boosted one. Props!
    Thanks!

    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by ultimateendz Click here to enlarge
    horsepower sells cars, torque wins races
    +1

    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by LostMarine Click here to enlarge
    where is this located? not many matte bvlue dct cars out there with a 625 kit
    In mexico Click here to enlarge

    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by leo985i Click here to enlarge
    So you are telling me that heavy ass camaro with 520whp vs the lighter M3 with DCT and 570whp is faster than the ///M? Wtf?
    To be honest, I was expecting to get beaten, but like every person said, torque won the race for this one.

    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sledgehammer Click here to enlarge
    Torque... That LS has boat loads of it from most every rpm especially down low. The M3 while efficient does not have the Tq to move it down low. DCT helps it not get destroyed and you can clearly see the nose lift on each run on the M3 he is WOT even jumps a slight bit. But tq moves you and that's a great display in what tq does for a car. HP is nice for damn sure but Tq down low and in the mid range is hard to beat. Great run and the M looks the business. Feels local for some reason.
    Yes I noticed the jumps as well, but I didnt want to write them in the vid., since some people can $#@! about it. Even though I have a big cam that really shines on high rpm's, still managed to pull at low end as well.

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by AWD75 Click here to enlarge
    Thanks!


    im gonna take a shot in the dark and say the maro is yours?...lol Click here to enlarge
    "We need to upgrade your skill before we upgrade your horsepower"

    -Tommy to Josh

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by LostMarine Click here to enlarge
    highly unlikely. that camaro is fast, but some people have accused him of having some go go juice.. but then again, ya never know.. need to find the M3 owner..
    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sledgehammer Click here to enlarge
    Here we go with excuses... If he is spraying that shot is small as hell, subtle and no crazy hit of power.
    No, there is no nitrous. I even put the engine bay shots of the camaro in the vid as well. I will be dialing a 200 shot in a month or so tho... You can find all the info about the car in this link:

    http://www.camaro5.com/forums/showthread.php?t=258632


    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by ultimateendz Click here to enlarge
    im gonna take a shot in the dark and say the maro is yours?...lol Click here to enlarge
    Yep

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    im not calling BS. ANd if i were, it would be more so on the M3. but taken at face value, i dont see how a 570hp dct m3 WONT PULL on a 520hp 4k lb camaro.

    just a few hours ago, some of you were talking about a 700lb and 40hp difference, yet here it doesnt apply?

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by LostMarine Click here to enlarge
    im not calling BS. ANd if i were, it would be more so on the M3. but taken at face value, i dont see how a 570hp dct m3 WONT PULL on a 520hp 4k lb camaro.

    just a few hours ago, some of you were talking about a 700lb and 40hp difference, yet here it doesnt apply?
    camaros arent as heavy as a V is to my knowledge tho...they are about 3700lbs vs 4200lbs
    "We need to upgrade your skill before we upgrade your horsepower"

    -Tommy to Josh

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sledgehammer Click here to enlarge
    Torque... That LS has boat loads of it from most every rpm especially down low. The M3 while efficient does not have the Tq to move it down low. DCT helps it not get destroyed and you can clearly see the nose lift on each run on the M3 he is WOT even jumps a slight bit. But tq moves you and that's a great display in what tq does for a car. HP is nice for damn sure but Tq down low and in the mid range is hard to beat. Great run and the M looks the business. Feels local for some reason.
    There's this thing called gearing or else diesels would rule roll on races.

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sledgehammer Click here to enlarge
    Torque... That LS has boat loads of it from most every rpm especially down low. The M3 while efficient does not have the Tq to move it down low. DCT helps it not get destroyed and you can clearly see the nose lift on each run on the M3 he is WOT even jumps a slight bit. But tq moves you and that's a great display in what tq does for a car. HP is nice for damn sure but Tq down low and in the mid range is hard to beat. Great run and the M looks the business. Feels local for some reason.

    Thats not always true look at a viper 8.4L tq monster vs a z06.... or look at a viper vs a evo with 450whp the evo wins... Ill tell you what this camaro has a 6.3L or a 7L swap its not a 6.0 with cams and bolt ons....

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by 600whp S4 Click here to enlarge
    Thats not always true look at a viper 8.4L tq monster vs a z06.... or look at a viper vs a evo with 450whp the evo wins... Ill tell you what this camaro has a 6.3L or a 7L swap its not a 6.0 with cams and bolt ons....
    More often than not it is the case. In terms of the EVO while its a 4cyl motor its got an incredible tq band and with 450whp they go damn well. If the EVO is anywhere near its boost curve its gonna be a problem. When done correctly it has very little in the way of lag.
    We stay swingin...
    Click here to enlarge

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by AWD75 Click here to enlarge
    Any link?
    http://www.m3post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=784815
    COBB AP ProTune by Bren of ///Bren Tuning
    Akrapovic DP | Helix FMIC | Alpina TCM Flash | Walbro 450LPH Fuel Pump


    "The moment money becomes your motivation, you are immediately not as good as someone who is motivated by passion and internal will." -A. Senna

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by leo985i Click here to enlarge
    So you are telling me that heavy ass camaro with 520whp vs the lighter M3 with DCT and 570whp is faster than the ///M? Wtf?
    I've always said dyno numbers don't mean $#@!.

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by leo985i Click here to enlarge
    So you are telling me that heavy ass camaro with 520whp vs the lighter M3 with DCT and 570whp is faster than the ///M? Wtf?
    Exactly, impossible.

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