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  1. #1
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    does anybody run track days with tunes?

    Real world experience with any of the aftermarket tunes? I am reasonably happy with the car but mathematically the 6th root principal dictates that a 1:35.0 lap time would be 1:32.5 with 279hp and time is time.

    I am slightly worried about the raw abuse that the engine would endure though even 5, 20 minute sessions once per month.

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    N20 tunes are so mild I think you really have nothing to worry about.

    What tune were you thinking of getting?
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    You're not gonna get much of a gain from a tune that give you max 40 hp at best on a circuit. The biggest time gains will be from suspension, brake, and tire upgrades.

    If you track your car on a monthly basis, you're gonna increase your engine wear regardless of a tune or not. Not sure abou the N20, but on my N54 with a JB4, I can get a good 5/6 laps (depends on temps) in before I need to let the engine and brakes cool off for a lap or 2.
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Scourge82 Click here to enlarge
    You're not gonna get much of a gain from a tune that give you max 40 hp at best on a circuit. The biggest time gains will be from suspension, brake, and tire upgrades.
    But combining a tune with this won't hurt and will certainly improve performance.
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
    But combining a tune with this won't hurt and will certainly improve performance.
    Yeah a tune will help his times. If Brian plans on making his car a track car also, the other upgrades are a must for max time shaving.
    2010 335i Coupe Le Mans Blue
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    None of the tuners seem to be releasing much in the way of data so there is no real way to know if one is 35psi and 15:1 A/F so cost seems to distinguish them the most and BMS with their beta seems to be high on my list because they're offering updates and have a presence on the forums.

    I have experience driving in one of the major race series so I understand some of the shortcomings of this car but I am probably more abusive than most drivers but I think like most of us, this is a street car primarily so I'm not trying to build for that. Up until just recently there were no coilover options (and I believe still a lack of options with adjustable tophats) and the aftermarket brake options have not been ideal (m brakes have a lack of pads that I know, stoptech being fairly expensive although I have looked into fitting some brembo f40 calipers)

    BMS/other +40hp tune, mathematically 2.5 seconds or 3% ($400 or less?)

    H&R springs bought arguably a couple of tenths on a 90 second lap, tested on the same day about an hour apart from stock ($300 I think I spent)

    Proper alignment bought nearly a full second (free, think 8th total front toe in, 0 rear toe)

    Brakes, 0.909g on the first hard stop from 107mph which is actually superb if the graph would stay there for any length of time, 0.758g peak once warm but down to 0.654g after a heavy zone. For reference here are some mid session numbers from the same track but different days, a Porsche GT3 with hoosiers is 0.984g, a spec miata is 0.843g. Arguably 30% better brakes would be great, but I don't believe the M performance set for $2000 would yield that but the stoptechs might at $3000.

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by brian99997 Click here to enlarge
    None of the tuners seem to be releasing much in the way of data so there is no real way to know if one is 35psi and 15:1 A/F so cost seems to distinguish them the most and BMS with their beta seems to be high on my list because they're offering updates and have a presence on the forums.
    BMS releases data and you can just ask @Terry@BMS.
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    Terry doesn't seem to accept PM's here, I'll see about emailing them. Thanks

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by brian99997 Click here to enlarge
    Terry doesn't seem to accept PM's here, I'll see about emailing them. Thanks
    Yes I know I attempted to call him to the thread. You can send him an e-mail at terry@burgertuning.com
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    Semi slicks will bring you a few more seconds.
    Also, if you can change the brake pads yourself, some Ferodo 3000 or similar brake pads will also let you brake later consistantly without fading after one lap. Just remember those kind of pads are NOT for public roads. They just don't function cold.
    A LSD should seriously help you to get out of a corner better. This is an upgrade I can recomend even if you don't track your car.
    It's all about having fun out there Click here to enlarge
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
    Yes I know I attempted to call him to the thread. You can send him an e-mail at terry@burgertuning.com
    Sorry, I don't use the "mention" system. The N20 tuning is still in its infancy. Maybe 100 of our Stage1 tunes are out in use and they are working well. No feedback from extended road race courses, though. Given proper octane I don't expect any issues at these mild boost levels.
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    It is the sole responsibility of the purchaser and installer of any BMS part to employ the correct installation techniques required to ensure the proper operation of BMS parts, and BMS disclaims any and all liability for any part failure due to improper installation or use. It is the sole responsibility of the customer to verify that the use of their vehicle and items purchased comply with federal, state and local regulations. BMS claims no legal federal, state or local certification concerning pollution controlled motor vehicles or mandated emissions requirements. BMS products labeled for use only in competition racing vehicles may only be used on competition racing vehicles operated exclusively on a closed course in conjunction with a sanctioned racing event, in accordance with all federal and state laws, and may never be operated on public roads/highways. Please see http://www.burgertuning.com/emissions_info.html for more information on legal requirements related to use of BMS parts.

  12. #12
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    Although NOT a BMW, I have tracked two MB's with tunes at Beaverun.

    The extra power was nice in the straights, but this lead to the brakes working harder, read this as fading faster.

    I would have NO issue running a tuned car at the track and MANY of my friends do in P cars, BMW's, etc, etc.

    AS was stated above, the #1 gain, read this as loss in lap times, is TIRES. R compounds are good for OVER 2 seconds at Nelson ledges, and almost 1.5 at Beaverun. My favorite street/track tire is Bridgstome 040 PP's.

    Next would be a close toss up between suspension and brakes. It would depend more on what you are sating with on this one. At the very least get some EBC redstuff, or any track rated pad, as the stockers do not last very long, or for that matter work well.

    In my C32 AMG, the stock pads would fade after about 15-16 laps at Beaverun. With EBC reds, NEVER

    Note: If this is your first time at the track, leave EVERYTHING stock. Learn how to drive first my friend.

    Also, R compound tires do work VERY well, but they give you less warning at the limits then street tires. Something that could bite you in the ass if you do not have much experience.

    Good luck, and have fun!!

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    Hey, kieep in mind two facts guys:

    1. If you make more HP, you WILL make more heat. Think radiator and oil cooler here. Might not be very important for 10-30 HP, but when you add addtional boost, or radical mods, it WILL show up at the track.

    2. R type tires will show suspension defiencies. Think springs here guys. The first time I switched to BFG R's, I was bottoming out my left front at Nelson ledges in almost every corner. So grippier tire, require stiffer spring.

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Terry@BMS Click here to enlarge
    Sorry, I don't use the "mention" system. The N20 tuning is still in its infancy. Maybe 100 of our Stage1 tunes are out in use and they are working well. No feedback from extended road race courses, though. Given proper octane I don't expect any issues at these mild boost levels.
    There we go. Hope you will use the system as it helps call attention.
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    2 out of 2 members liked this post. Reputation: Yes | No
    So getting back to Brian's question...

    Almost every N54/N55 equipped car in which I have instructed has gone into limp mode at least once, tuned or not. In one car the tune was causing a horrible misfire that went away when my student reverted to the stock map. It really got my attention on the front straight of Chuckwalla when the car nearly stopped completely.

    What the N20 will do is hard to tell. There just aren't enough of us taking them to the track yet to provide any reliable data. It would be really nice if some of the tuners would come out to track events and log some data with their devices so we can make informed decisions.

    Regarding coilovers - Brian please note that KW just released V3's for this application.

    As for brakes I am working on something to help. Hopefully my car will be setup with proper brake cooling by 10/1 for the BMW CCA LA HPDE at Auto Club Speedway. I will do some testing if so and report back.

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by mocohead Click here to enlarge
    So getting back to Brian's question...

    Almost every N54/N55 equipped car in which I have instructed has gone into limp mode at least once, tuned or not. In one car the tune was causing a horrible misfire that went away when my student reverted to the stock map. It really got my attention on the front straight of Chuckwalla when the car nearly stopped completely.

    What the N20 will do is hard to tell. There just aren't enough of us taking them to the track yet to provide any reliable data. It would be really nice if some of the tuners would come out to track events and log some data with their devices so we can make informed decisions.

    Regarding coilovers - Brian please note that KW just released V3's for this application.

    As for brakes I am working on something to help. Hopefully my car will be setup with proper brake cooling by 10/1 for the BMW CCA LA HPDE at Auto Club Speedway. I will do some testing if so and report back.
    Very nice post.
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    1 out of 1 members liked this post. Reputation: Yes | No
    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by mocohead Click here to enlarge
    So getting back to Brian's question...

    Almost every N54/N55 equipped car in which I have instructed has gone into limp mode at least once, tuned or not. In one car the tune was causing a horrible misfire that went away when my student reverted to the stock map. It really got my attention on the front straight of Chuckwalla when the car nearly stopped completely.

    What the N20 will do is hard to tell. There just aren't enough of us taking them to the track yet to provide any reliable data. It would be really nice if some of the tuners would come out to track events and log some data with their devices so we can make informed decisions.

    Regarding coilovers - Brian please note that KW just released V3's for this application.

    As for brakes I am working on something to help. Hopefully my car will be setup with proper brake cooling by 10/1 for the BMW CCA LA HPDE at Auto Club Speedway. I will do some testing if so and report back.
    So far I personally only have 4, 20 minute sessions on this car and aside from having to change my braking zone the car was fine at the track and the brakes stopped squeaking a few days later. I will remember to install a wideband o2 sensor and find the rpm wire to log some of the stock engine stats although like you said, the tuners probably have better access to sensors than I do but they tend to only work on dynos and rarely drag strips where 100% throttle is the only input which is basically why tuners like Dinan are crazy expensive in comparison.

    Hmm still no adjustable camber plates. These were similar to the units on my e46 m3 from turner, http://www.turnermotorsport.com/p-10...ort-track.aspx so I'm a bit surprised that KW didn't appear to release these coilovers with their own because the e9x and 1m kit has the adjustable camber mounts because they are essentially part of the top of the shock that you would have to remove from the stock setup anyway. Apparently the "feel" of the e46 being so similar when I did the H&R spring install does not represent any similarity in the actual part fitment and just poking through turners site indicates bmw has never had this part that fit more than 1 model year of one type of car (318, 328, 330, m3 all having different parts)

    Thanks for the feedback guys, I didn't really think many would have experience with tunes on a road course. Really the stock power felt fairly good, but like I said in the first post, 3% or 2.5s less lap time for less than $400 was sounding really good to someone that had already found the limit of the stock setup. I believe R compounds would be more like 4 seconds due to how completely inadequate the goodyear runflats are but they would hurt the brakes and the already floaty suspension so the net gain is probably not worth as much and due to the cars lack of camber would probably result in cording the outside edge of the tires within a few runs on something like a hoosier r6.

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