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  1. #226
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    ^ This is from the built motor, right?

  2. #227
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
    ^ This is from the built motor, right?
    No those are the stock OEM pistons, doing that to forged aftermarket pistons is practically impossible.

  3. #228
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by MSpiredM3 Click here to enlarge
    No those are the stock OEM pistons, doing that to forged aftermarket pistons is practically impossible.
    If anyone could do it, I'm sure VF could Click here to enlarge

    Just messing around, good pics though and the stock pistons don't look weak by any means.

  4. #229
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by ccsykes Click here to enlarge
    Show me a VF car that has had burned/melted pistons, burned/melted spark plug electrodes etc.. and I will agree with the argument that VF's tune is potentially too lean. Broken ring lands, pounded bearings etc.. are a sign of detonation which means someone was using too low an octane. Of all the message board drama I have read about VF, I have never seen an ounce of proof there is anything wrong with the tune. What I have seen is crappy engine builders and piss poor customer service.. it had nothing to do with the tune as far as I could tell.
    Fess up! lol

    Here is one of the pistons from my 3rd motor build with a melted skirt. All the pistons had this damage in nearly every corner, but this was was the worst one so I used only used this one to take pics since it is very hard to capture the damage in a pic with just a plain snap and shoot camera

    Click here to enlarge

    Click here to enlarge

    Click here to enlarge

  5. #230
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    Dude thats messed up!
    Click here to enlarge



    EURO 04 M3 Current Mods:GC DAs, Eibach Sways, PF RTAB's, RE RCAs, INTRAVEE II, Black Roundels, ///MFEST Badges, Depo's, Screen protector for NAV display, VCSL Bumper + Race Lip & CF Trunk & CF Rear Diffusor, DIETZ TV in Motion, SS= V1 Headers + catless pipes + X-Pipe + SS Sport Exhaust, Z8 Starter Button, Lamin-X, OEM CSL interior, OEM CSL Steering, OEM CSL Intake, OEM CSL Roof, MSS54HP + OEM CSL Tune, BBS CH's, LIGHTWERKZ, 355mm ST40 BBK, BW Oil Cooler....

  6. #231
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    1 out of 2 members liked this post. Reputation: Yes | No
    The pictures you posted don't look like a piston that burned due to a lean condition. They look like a piston that was dropped prior to install, installed improperly, or the cylinder was machined improperly. In an extreme lean condition the carbon would have burned off the top of the piston before the failure of the metal. You still have carbon on that piston. Also there is no "spatter" from the melted material popping which would result when the lean condition causes detonation.

    Again.. I still see no proof of engine damage resulting from a bad tune or lean condition. What I would surmise from those photos is an incompetent engine builder.

    Here is the picture of a piston burned from a lean condition... you have spatter, burned ring lands and the carbon is fully burned off the piston leaving only the patina finish (shiny smooth finish versus flat/rough finish).

    Click here to enlarge



    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by MSpiredM3 Click here to enlarge
    Fess up! lol

    Click here to enlarge
    Last edited by ccsykes; 07-14-2010 at 01:19 PM.

  7. #232
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    Here is another example of a burnt piston due to a lean condition..

    Click here to enlarge

  8. #233
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    I agree with you that an extreme lean condition wasn't what caused this damage, but melted skirts were not from being dropped or anything of the sort, the skirts are definitely melted and confirmed by CP pistons themselves.

  9. #234
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    1 out of 1 members liked this post. Reputation: Yes | No
    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by MSpiredM3 Click here to enlarge
    I agree with you that an extreme lean condition wasn't what caused this damage, but melted skirts were not from being dropped or anything of the sort, the skirts are definitely melted and confirmed by CP pistons themselves.
    Then to me that would be indicative of too loose piston to wall clearance, or improperly bored cylinder. A bad tune would not burn,melt the skirt but leave the ring lands and piston top virtually unscathed.

    I believe you got a raw deal on the engine build bud, I'm not stating otherwise. If VF outsourced the build then they do share some of the blame. I'm sure VF is aware of the mistake they made and because they obviously to not have a compentent builder, this may be the reason they no longer offer the Stage III build in house. They only offer the components now and take no responsibility for the build.

    I believe cost may have played a role as well. I have priced a number of proven, competent S54 builders and they all average around $13K - $15K for a boosted motor build. Outsourcing costs like that can tend to make anyone cringe and obviously VF chose to outsource to a cheaper builder. This is probably why HPF is doing so well as they have a competent builder In house..

    Everything said, I still don't believe your problems were a result of VF's kit or engineering, but simply the result of a crappy engine builder.

  10. #235
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by ccsykes Click here to enlarge
    Then to me that would be indicative of too loose piston to wall clearance, or improperly bored cylinder. A bad tune would not burn,melt the skirt but leave the ring lands and piston top virtually unscathed.

    I believe you got a raw deal on the engine build bud, I'm not stating otherwise. If VF outsourced the build then they do share some of the blame. I'm sure VF is aware of the mistake they made and because they obviously to not have a compentent builder, this may be the reason they no longer offer the Stage III build in house. They only offer the components now and take no responsibility for the build.

    I believe cost may have played a role as well. I have priced a number of proven, competent S54 builders and they all average around $13K - $15K for a boosted motor build. Outsourcing costs like that can tend to make anyone cringe and obviously VF chose to outsource to a cheaper builder. This is probably why HPF is doing so well as they have a competent builder In house..

    Everything said, I still don't believe your problems were a result of VF's kit or engineering, but simply the result of a crappy engine builder.
    In my opinion you nailed it with the cost. This motor was not put together properly as the evidence suggests and is more the fault of the motor build than the tune. However, VF skimped on the motor build, trying to get it done as cheap as possible and it really ended up costing them in the long run.

  11. #236
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    holy piston rings batman!

  12. #237
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    Wasn't the motor built by VF the first time then was built by another person after a motor failure?

  13. #238
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by TaZaM3 Click here to enlarge
    Wasn't the motor built by VF the first time then was built by another person after a motor failure?
    I know some other company did the second one, VF outsourced that. Not sure on the first one.

  14. #239
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    1 out of 1 members liked this post. Reputation: Yes | No
    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by TaZaM3 Click here to enlarge
    Wasn't the motor built by VF the first time then was built by another person after a motor failure?
    Yea, first motor build was in house at VF, second motor build was outsourced to a local shop called Ronin

  15. #240
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    For some reason I love the term in house.
    Click here to enlargeClick here to enlarge

  16. #241
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by GG///M3 Click here to enlarge
    For some reason I love the term in house.
    You were thinking Full House.

  17. #242
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
    You were thinking Full House.
    Damn man.. someone gave me a negative rep for giving an opinion on 20 years of racing experience and dozens of motor builds? Bleh..

  18. #243
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by ccsykes Click here to enlarge
    Damn man.. someone gave me a negative rep for giving an opinion on 20 years of racing experience and dozens of motor builds? Bleh..
    Be happy this isn't youtube Click here to enlarge

    Don't worry about it, can't please everyone.

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