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  1. #26
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    What is andygate?
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  2. #27
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by DBFIU Click here to enlarge
    Interesting, definitely. I would assume all their systems are part of an intranet, so we could assume that a 'spy' got in, hooked in and uploaded the virus. Because there would be no way (unless Iran is infinitely stupid) they would have those systems hooked up the internet... It's definitely a good way to not waste human lives, but is it enough? Sure it sets em back 4 years... But what about the systems not hooked up to any intra/internets? What about the stand alone systems... (im sure they have a few)...
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  3. #28
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    Isn't Russia supporting Iran, they told israel that their making a mistake if they start a war.

    By the way what did Sorena do?
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  4. #29
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    He asked too many questions about Stage 1 JB3 N55
    He let the centrifuge's get infected...
    He spoke out about the current regime...
    He... I can't come up with anything else...
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  5. #30
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    He supported a vendor Sticky had a problem with, and spoke for him when Andy's possibilities to post were blocked.
    There are two theories to arguing with women. Neither one works

  6. #31
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by DavidV Click here to enlarge
    He supported a vendor Sticky had a problem with, and spoke for him when Andy's possibilities to post were blocked.
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    Sounds vaguely familiar, like a certain tuner on...

    Anyway, back to the topic at hand...
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  7. #32
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    This reminds me of the time in history where the United States used scare tactics on it's population with the Red Scare. It got the United States in a bunch of stupid meaningless wars, cost a $#@! ton of money, and servicemen lives all for a pseudo threat.
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  8. #33
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    Last time the USA made a stealt attack into Iran a Chinook crashed in the desert, and things did not improve at all...
    There are two theories to arguing with women. Neither one works

  9. #34
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by sr20seb Click here to enlarge
    This reminds me of the time in history where the United States used scare tactics on it's population with the Red Scare. It got the United States in a bunch of stupid meaningless wars, cost a $#@! ton of money, and servicemen lives all for a pseudo threat.
    Overall a good point. But this is like the story of the boy who cried wolf. Now that there is a real threat people are not going to act, and that will be the most grave decision of all.
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  10. #35
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by dreikraft Click here to enlarge
    we're already throwng enough money at israel from our taxpayers pockets.

    i look at the US in the middle east like i look at gov bail outs. it just shouldn't have happened. unless US funded israel has kept the arab league under some sort of power ceiling this has all been a complete waste.
    plus whether the US military sheds blood over there in iran or not won't change that it still costs US tax payers to fund israeli military operations.
    israel is the tarbaby that's kept us glued to that $#@!hole corner of the world for over 60 years.


    why is there still rep system in OT?
    So much of the U.S.'s software technology is developed/produced in Israel. That alone gives the U.S. great incentive to maintain strong support for Israel.

    Also, plenty of military intelligence for the Middle East is gathered by Isreal.

    Isreal has done a very good job at not squandering the resources that the U.S. has provided them.

  11. #36
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by DBFIU Click here to enlarge
    Overall a good point. But this is like the story of the boy who cried wolf. Now that there is a real threat people are not going to act, and that will be the most grave decision of all.
    Pakistan has been nuclear for over a decade. Their population is widely anti-American, $#@! they even harbored the biggest enemy of the "Free World" Osama bin Laden. Then their government interrogated the guy who game him up to the United States. Why don't we shake in our boots about them? They are not our friend, never was, never will.

    Iran's population on the other hand isn't as anti-West as the leaders of that country would lead us all to believe. Hope everybody remember the protests that went on for nearly an entire year 2009-2010, the internet completely shut off, the killings of innocent students who were protesting the election that everybody knows was rigged. The clerical regime in that country is not loved or embraced. If you want a modern comparison of how a government can keep it's population hostage you don't have to go far. If you're not familiar look up the 1968 invasion of former Czechoslovakia, and Martial Law in Poland from 1981-1983.

    The idea that a nuclear weapon from Iran will make it's way to Israel or to the United States is also quite absurd. The distance between the 2 countries (Israel and Iran) is over 1000 miles. To deliver a nuclear weapon to hit an area as small as Israel will require a highly advanced technology, that Iran does not posses and will not for quite a long time if ever. To hit a target that far away would require for them to figure out a way to launch a nuclear warhead into space and then bring it back in and drop it down on Israel. Iran's newest cruise missile can only travel for about 120 miles, way way short of the intended pseudo target. The only other way to deliver it is by an airplane, which would have to travel through Iraq's airspace (good luck with that). Saudi Arabia (not a chance) or Syria (which is currently locked down by NATO and will be for a long long time.)
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  12. #37
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by sr20seb Click here to enlarge
    Pakistan has been nuclear for over a decade. Their population is widely anti-American, $#@! they even harbored the biggest enemy of the "Free World" Osama bin Laden. Then their government interrogated the guy who game him up to the United States. Why don't we shake in our boots about them? They are not our friend, never was, never will.

    Iran's population on the other hand isn't as anti-West as the leaders of that country would lead us all to believe. Hope everybody remember the protests that went on for nearly an entire year 2009-2010, the internet completely shut off, the killings of innocent students who were protesting the election that everybody knows was rigged. The clerical regime in that country is not loved or embraced. If you want a modern comparison of how a government can keep it's population hostage you don't have to go far. If you're not familiar look up the 1968 invasion of former Czechoslovakia, and Martial Law in Poland from 1981-1983.

    The idea that a nuclear weapon from Iran will make it's way to Israel or to the United States is also quite absurd. The distance between the 2 countries (Israel and Iran) is over 1000 miles. To deliver a nuclear weapon to hit an area as small as Israel will require a highly advanced technology, that Iran does not posses and will not for quite a long time if ever. To hit a target that far away would require for them to figure out a way to launch a nuclear warhead into space and then bring it back in and drop it down on Israel. Iran's newest cruise missile can only travel for about 120 miles, way way short of the intended pseudo target. The only other way to deliver it is by an airplane, which would have to travel through Iraq's airspace (good luck with that). Saudi Arabia (not a chance) or Syria (which is currently locked down by NATO and will be for a long long time.)
    With regard to your question about U.S. attitude toward Pakistan, we do "shake our boots at them." Simple as that. The feeling in the U.S. toward Pakistan is one of distrust, but given the instability within Pakistan's own population (i.e., the vast disparity of religious/political beliefs) especially in the border regions compared to many of the urban centers, it is not a country that we can categorically label an enemy.

    It is difficult to know who exactly possesses control over the nuclear weapons in Pakistan. They have a civilian/military makeup similar to Egypt. There is more of a tug-of-war in their own country concerning military control compared to Iran, which is more focused in their ideology and allegience.

    U.S. relies on Pakistani intelligence to an extent. No one outside of the higher-ups in charge know to what extent we rely on such intelligence, but there is at least an an understanding that we expect solid intel in exchange for our massive funding to their country.

    Iran, in contrast, does no bidding for the U.S..

    If you think Iran's weapons do not make their way into Israel, you are kidding yourself. Hezbollah, for instance is supplied largely by Iran and it is Iranian missles that find their way into Israel by Hezbollah at the command of Iran.

    Iran can reach deep into Israel by their proxy army, Hezbollah.

    "Iran has admitted that it did indeed supply long-range Zelzal-2 missiles to Hizbullah. The longer-range Zelzal missiles, manufactured by Iran and are capable of reaching Tel Aviv, Jerusalem and Beer Sheva in the Negev. In making this announcement, Iran reinforced its statement of "wiping Israel off the map."

    Even if Iran doesn't pull the trigger any time soon, they want the Israeli public to live in fear. This a bonafide and time-tested military tactic. Keeping a populace on ice is akin to eroding their liberty. This is war in itself, similar to the threat of terror that U.S. citizens live with since 9/11.

  13. #38
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    I am no nuclear scientist, but if I were a country like Iran and wanted to inflict harm on Israel, I wouldn't waste time and money on developing rockets--frankly, a half dozen suitcase nukes would be cheaper (I'm assuming) and easier to deploy inside the country. Didn't the Russians "misplace" a handful of these devices--maybe a couple made their way to Iran so their engineers could use them as a model. I really don't think the leaders of Iran would totally launch a strike immediately anyway--I think they want it as a bargaining chip first and foremost.

    If any leader ever launched an unprovoked nuclear attack on any other country, especially the US or one of its allies, it would absolutely spell extinction for that country and its people. The American people, the majority anyway, would have absolutely no problem retaliating in kind--just ask the poor people of Japan if we're crazy enough!

    Just my .02
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  14. #39
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    It is much more difficult to smuggle in a live nuclear warhead into Israel than a missile. And a nuclear missile strike by Iran on Israel will carry a huge backlash from everybody, they will lose support from Russia, they will lose support from China, none of the middle eastern countries will support that in their right mind. It's something they can't afford to carry out or be involved in. Not only that it will be a perfect opportunity for everybody else from the world community to stick their nose into Iran once again and that is something they don't want. They know all too well their military can't stand up to Israel, let alone U.S. and NATO involvement.
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  15. #40
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    I don't think it was Iran's intention to ever launch a true nuclear missle. They want the warhead so they can either sell it to someone who will use it against Israel or give it to someone to smuggle it in. It is very easy to smuggle a truck sized load into a country. Hell they dont even need to smuggle it in, just get it to the border and set it off. Israel is such a small country that most of the populated cities are close to at least one border.

    I don't think you understand the danger Iran poses to the world vs. Pakistan. You sound like someone that is advocating for Iran to become nuclear.

    And I hate when people say "well if Israel has nukes then why isn't fair for Iran to have nukes". Because that is the stupidest $#@! I've ever heard. Israel has nuclear warheads, they have never used one.

    Iran willingly and openly expressed Israel as being an ally of the 'great satan' (The USA) and must be destroyed.

    I dont see what is difficult to understand.
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  16. #41
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by dreikraft Click here to enlarge
    why is there still rep system in OT?
    So you can reward good posts. Some guys just like OT.

  17. #42
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by sr20seb Click here to enlarge
    The idea that a nuclear weapon from Iran will make it's way to Israel or to the United States is also quite absurd. The distance between the 2 countries (Israel and Iran) is over 1000 miles. To deliver a nuclear weapon to hit an area as small as Israel will require a highly advanced technology, that Iran does not posses and will not for quite a long time if ever. To hit a target that far away would require for them to figure out a way to launch a nuclear warhead into space and then bring it back in and drop it down on Israel. Iran's newest cruise missile can only travel for about 120 miles, way way short of the intended pseudo target. The only other way to deliver it is by an airplane, which would have to travel through Iraq's airspace (good luck with that). Saudi Arabia (not a chance) or Syria (which is currently locked down by NATO and will be for a long long time.)
    I'm sure they could figure out how to hit Israel. Not really worried about Iran attacking the US.

  18. #43
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by DBFIU Click here to enlarge
    I don't think you understand the danger Iran poses to the world vs. Pakistan. You sound like someone that is advocating for Iran to become nuclear.
    So explain it to me. And I have never advocated for them to gain nuclear weapons, but isn't it the right of any country on this planet to defend itself from anybody in a best way possible? Who get's to say any differently?

    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by DBFIU Click here to enlarge
    And I hate when people say "well if Israel has nukes then why isn't fair for Iran to have nukes". Because that is the stupidest $#@! I've ever heard. Israel has nuclear warheads, they have never used one.
    Right, and neither have any of the countries who are labeled the "Axis of Evil", the only country to use nuclear weapons in a conflict is the United States.

    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by DBFIU Click here to enlarge
    Iran willingly and openly expressed Israel as being an ally of the 'great satan' (The USA) and must be destroyed.
    Lot's of countries said things that echo the same, Iraq, Egypt, Afghanistan, Jordan, Palestine, Syria, Saudi Arabia even is the one country who actually supplies terrorists with terrorists.......
    But for some reason (maybe magic is involved) it's quite okay to outfit these countries with American made weapons? Since when have they become our friends? Horse$#@!!
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by sr20seb Click here to enlarge
    So explain it to me. And I have never advocated for them to gain nuclear weapons, but isn't it the right of any country on this planet to defend itself from anybody in a best way possible? Who get's to say any differently?



    Right, and neither have any of the countries who are labeled the "Axis of Evil", the only country to use nuclear weapons in a conflict is the United States.



    Lot's of countries said things that echo the same, Iraq, Egypt, Afghanistan, Jordan, Palestine, Syria, Saudi Arabia even is the one country who actually supplies terrorists with terrorists.......
    But for some reason (maybe magic is involved) it's quite okay to outfit these countries with American made weapons? Since when have they become our friends? Horse$#@!!
    Just to clarify, there is no such country as Palestine. I keep up with the news fairly well and I haven't heard of this development. Click here to enlarge

  20. #45
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by sr20seb Click here to enlarge
    So explain it to me. And I have never advocated for them to gain nuclear weapons, but isn't it the right of any country on this planet to defend itself from anybody in a best way possible? Who get's to say any differently?
    You make a good point. Where Iran is located and what is going on with their neighbors... I don't blame them.

  21. #46
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sonny Click here to enlarge
    Just to clarify, there is no such country as Palestine. I keep up with the news fairly well and I haven't heard of this development. Click here to enlarge
    Perhaps a better question is, should there be a country of Palestine? I think we know what Israel thinks on this one.

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
    Perhaps a better question is, should there be a country of Palestine? I think we know what Israel thinks on this one.
    It's a very good question.

    Currently, there are a lot of Israelis who want to see a two-state solution. I think even Israel's government is not 100% aligned in their stance on this topic.

    Personally, I do not see a two-state solution. I think it is a mistake and I will openly claim that the only solution in this particular region is for the Palestinian "people" to give up and try to make their way in the Israeli state and/or other neighboring countries.

    The Hamas government system is a joke. It is a military system that has a political front which is meaningless when the 5hit hits the fan. You cannot have stability based on a country that is run by a military wing in effect but claims to be a democratic government.

  23. #48
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sonny Click here to enlarge
    Personally, I do not see a two-state solution. I think it is a mistake and I will openly claim that the only solution in this particular region is for the Palestinian "people" to give up and try to make their way in the Israeli state and/or other neighboring countries.
    Wow, the only solution is for them to give up? Really?

    Maybe Palestine needs someone like Britain on their side, or the French to sell them weapons, or recognition by a super power? Know of any other state that managed to establish itself out of nowhere in that region with these conditions?

  24. #49
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sonny Click here to enlarge
    You cannot have stability based on a country that is run by a military wing in effect but claims to be a democratic government.
    We seem to do it fine.

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
    Wow, the only solution is for them to give up? Really?

    Maybe Palestine needs someone like Britain on their side, or the French to sell them weapons, or recognition by a super power? Know of any other state that managed to establish itself out of nowhere in that region with these conditions?
    Yes, really.

    Hamas are terrorists. There is no such thing as Palestinians. This is a relatively new phenomenon--in the last 4 decades or so.

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